In his article on the current disagreements between Charles Johnson of LGF and some right-wing bloggers over “accusations of bigotry and treason”, David Weigel of the Washington Independent seems to have a hard time understanding the issues that divide “Terrorism-Watching Conservative Blogs.” He says:
But in the early days of Barack Obama’s presidency, LGF has become better known for the various fights it picks with many on the right — including conservative bloggers, critics of Islamic extremism, and critics of Islam in general who used to be Johnson’s fellow travelers….
Johnson supported Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.) in 2008, but he spent some of the campaign attacking anti-Obama conspiracy theorists, and he rejected the idea designs were malicious, rather than merely naive. Johnson worries, in conversation and on his blog, that his old allies have been duped by far-right European political parties and have bought into wild attacks on the president that discredit their own causes.
“I don’t think there is an anti-jihadist movement anymore,” Johnson said. “It’s all a bunch of kooks. I’ve watch some people who I thought were reputable, and who I trusted, hook up with racists and Nazis. I see a lot of them promoting stories and causes that I think are completely nuts.”
Johnson’s disgust with the terrorism-focused conservative blogosphere has had a traumatic effect on a dogged and dogmatic community of bloggers and scholars.
Like Charles Johnson and other anti-fascists, including Christopher Hitchens and the bloggers at Harry’s Place, I’m opposed to fascism. Like Hitchens, I believe that “swastika symbols exist for one purpose only—to be defaced.” I’m not as bold about my opinions as Hitchens is, but any form of genocidal authoritarianism combined with racism, any politically-based efforts to make laws condemning a group of people based on who they are rather than what they do, tends to piss me off.
That’s why I find it hard to support bloggers who claim to be against the Islamist-related brand of fascism, but who will write books with, feature and praise the work of somone like Serge Trifkovic, one of the leaders of the Bosnian Serbs during the years of ethnic cleansing. When bloggers say things like “the Nazis are not the problem”, this is also alarming.
Anyone who actually follows and reads the links that have been provided for years by “terrorism-watching” blogs like Robert Spencer’s Jihad Watch, Charles Johnson’s Little Green Footballs, Harry’s Place and Pamela Geller’s Atlas Shrugs would know that the source of Islamist terrorism is not “Islam”, it’s a political/paramilitary movement sponsored mostly by wealthy Saudis and Pakistanis and powerful Iranian mullahs. Training and planning are provided by Pakistani and Iranian intelligence agencies. Libya occasionally helps in these efforts. Although the Iranians, Pakistanis, Libyans, and Saudis fight amongst themselves, they also work together. Islam is used as an inspiration and a recruiting tool, but recruits are also inspired by drugs, money, the will to dominate and the joy they take in being aggressive towards people who can’t fight back.
If you follow the links and ignore the right/left controversies, the blogwars and the offbeat comments, this is the message you will get. All of these bloggers provide an essential service, combing through the international news for information that Fox News and CNN fail to provide. The differences between them tend to based on whether the blogger is anti-Islam or anti-fascist.
Charles Johnson has always been more anti-fascist than anti-Islam, which is why other anti-fascist bloggers, even leftists like David T. at Harry’s Place tend to understand where Charles is coming from:
Charles Johnson at Little Green Footballs has been reporting on an ‘anti-Islamisation’ conference organised by Pro Köln, which is the successor to the neo-fascist “Deutsche Liga für Volk und Heimat“.
We expect fascists to use anti-Muslim bigotry to advance their hateful politics. The British National Party are following precisely the same agenda in the United Kingdom.
If you are no longer capable of distinguishing between specific jihadist and Islamist parties – Hamas/Muslim Brotherhood and Jamaat-e-Islami – and ordinary Muslim citizens of your country, then you have crossed over the line. If you attend a conference organised by fascists, then you have also crossed over the line. You have become an anti-Muslim bigot.
Of Weigel’s article, Johnson says:
One more comment on this subject: this hasn’t been a sudden change at LGF. My refusal to associate with fascist groups is not new. It’s a core principle and always has been, and that’s why, when I saw the so-called “anti-jihad” bloggers starting to hook up with European neofascist groups two years ago, I could not remain silent.
The current controversy is just more proof that Jane’s Law…
The devotees of the party in power are smug and arrogant. The devotees of the party out of power are insane.
..is still true. Back in 2004, when the Left in America was out of power and getting kind of looney about it, Harry’s Place did not ‘get’ LGF. Like David Weigel they linked to the misleading Little Green Fascists Quiz, written by addled leftist LGF hater “Dr. Menlo”, as proof that LGF was tolerating fascist, right wing views.
Back in 2004, I wrote a quiz that showed that extremist, extrerminationist views, leaning very close to fascism, were currently more common on the left:
NAZI OR BLOGGER?
This quiz was inspired by this, and by this post, written by Matthew Yglesias.
Care to test your knowledge of current politics and ear for dialogue? Each of the following quotes represents either:
a) Charles or a comment from Little Green Footballs
- OR -
b) a Leftist, a Green or a Fascist.
See if you can tell which is which! This is a self-grading test (answers provided below), so if you get it wrong you have no one to blame but yourself.
…
“..there is no easy solution..for life to survive as we know it, millions of people are going to have to die. It’s sad to say that, but it’s true. Millions of people are already dying – it’s just gonna have to start happening here”
a) LGF
b) Leftist/Green/Fascist
[the answer is B, Environmental rights activist Craig ‘Critter’ Marshall]
…
“Palestinian Gumen Kill Theiving Israeli Settler..Gunmen kill three Israeli land thieves, plus one future land thief.”
a) LGF
b) Leftist/Green/Fascist
[the answer is B, Indymedia commenter Boaz describing the death of a five year old girl (the ‘future land thief’) and members of her family, shot in their beds by Palestinians]
…
“The son of Ikhlas Yassin (who had 7 children, not 3) says he was tortured by the Al Aqsa Martyrs’ Brigades until he invented the story that his mother was a collaborator.”
a) LGF
b) Leftist/Green/Fascist
[the answer is A, Charles linking to an article about the torture and murder of Bakir Khouli, a Palestinian mother of 7, by Arafat's Al Aqsa.]
…
“The outrage you hear is coming from Human Rights Watch, Amnesty International, the UN Commission for Human Rights, and all the various “Students for Justice in Palestine” groups on university campuses across the nation.”
“Awful quiet…..I’ll wait…..hrm…..crickets….”
a) LGF
b) Leftist/Green/Fascist
[the answer is A, LGF commenter David about 'humanitarian' reaction to the torture of Bakir Khouli]
…
“Only Israel would benefit from this war, and the Zionist warmongers in media and government seek to use America’s guns and money to strike devastating blows at Israel’s enemies. They also know that the ensuing war fever will shift attention away from Israel’s brutal terrorism and suppression against the Palestinian people.”
a) LGF
b) Leftist/Green/Fascist
[the answer is B, Nazi David Duke]
…
“I get so many emails and tips to articles these days that it’s simply impossible to read everything; one of the things I missed last week (although it was discussed quite a bit in our comments) was the story of former PLO terrorist Walid Shoebat, now an apostate Muslim and passionate pro-Western voice: From PLO Terrorist to Lover of Zion. (Hat tip: Nekama.)”
a) LGF
b) Leftist/Green/Fascist
[the answer is A, Charles]
…
“Shoebat began awakening from the death cult when his Christian wife challenged him to read the Bible”
“..Which is precisely why Bibles in Saudi Arabia are outlawed. To the extent that even the APO was denied mail service of Bibles to US military installations in the KSA.”
a) LGF
b) Leftist/Green/Fascist
[the answer is A, commenter Geepers, on Charles’ post about a former PLO terrorist]
…
And then there’s Rumsfeld who said of Iraq, ‘We have our good days and our bad days.’ We should put this S.O.B. up against a wall and say, ‘This is one of our bad days’ and pull the trigger.”
a) LGF
b) Leftist/Green/Fascist
[the answer is B, St. Petersburg Democratic Club]
…
“[Brooklyn-born settlers in Israel] should be shot dead. I think they are Nazis, racists, I feel nothing but hatred for them.”
a) LGF
b) Leftist/Green/Fascist
[the answer is B, Poet and Oxford Professor Tom Paulin]
…
“Students at University College Cork in Ireland have put together a list of well-known authors and speakers who are Jews, under the name Palestine: Information with Provenance. As LGF reader AWH put it, this is the Internet version of the Nazi yellow star.”
a) LGF
b) Leftist/Green/Fascist
[the answer is A, Charles’ post about a University-sponsored hate site]
…..
That was a pretty easy quiz, wasn’t it? Even without the answers, it’s easy to tell the difference between the real LGF and the leftist/green/fascist group.
If I wanted to make the quiz harder, I’d ask you to guess whether David Duke or Noam Chomsky said one thing or another. So many left/green/fascist extremists speak with the same voice lately. It’s hard to tell them apart.
In those days, there was no leftist equivalent of Charles Johnson speaking out against extremists or obsessed loonies like Noam Chomsky and the folks at Indymedia. It’s a shame, they could have used one.
The enemy of your enemy is not your friend. When Leftists tolerated and supported the extremists in their midst, they did great harm to their party. If the Right wing follows the same path, they can expect to be out of power for eight years, maybe longer.
We all need to pay attention to the voices of sanity in our midst. In the long run, the anti-fascist right and left will appreciate the work that Charles Johnson has done.
UPDATE: I was on a plane from NY to California all day yesterday, so I’m a little late in saying welcome to visitors from Little Green Footballs!
May 2, 2009 at 6:25 pm
I could not agree more that “We all need to pay attention to the voices of sanity in our midst. In the long run, the anti-fascist right and left will appreciate the work that Charles Johnson has done.”
But I’m wondering about the “When Leftists tolerated and supported the extremists in their midst, they did great harm to their party.”
What they actually did may in the long run (we can hope) do great harm to their party, but there is no denying that what they did in the short term was win control of the United States government.
May 2, 2009 at 7:03 pm
Thanks.
May 2, 2009 at 7:19 pm
The enemy of my enemy is not my friend.
NOT IN MY FOXHOLE… do they have caps with those announcements? Tired old crap…
Now what is I am to thank Charles Johnson for? And no..I am not a banned poster from the Charlie cult. I always have been the owner of my instincts and my reasoning.That is why I am not or have never been a lizard. Please..how many nazis do you know? I mean a real one…I bet 0.
A fringe element that will forever remain a fringe element. They are not behind every tree. And they sure as hell don’t build little round houses to teach murder and terror for jews and infidels. So cut the shit. And cut the shit on believing that Charles Johnson has any whatsoever influence over anything except his small party of Charles parrots. These people have no thoughts of their own or they are putting aside their true beliefs in order to stay a member of what used to be…For one slip of the tongue and they are history. Most of these people are good people.But it is truly a character flaw that keeps them walking the line. These same people are the ones that fall in love with a serial killer behind bars.
That thin veil has become so tattered charlie, that anyone can see thru it. Those slings against christians, against most all the conservatives that are trying to regain ground in the gop. All those slings though, will get you nowwhere. So while, Mary seems to be validating you….it won’t help you. You are fading in the sunset pal. and good riddance.
I am wondering though…if you have become a convert and your church is round..is it? It would make perfect sense.
Perhaps a more suitable better to understand question would be? Who the hell died and made you King?
May 2, 2009 at 9:07 pm
Got you link from LGF. Used to live in Hoboken in the Tea Building. I still miss the pizza.
I agree with #1, the extremeist actually won this round.
May 2, 2009 at 10:03 pm
“would know that the source of Islamist terrorism is not “Islam”, it’s a political/paramilitary movement sponsored mostly by wealthy Saudis and Pakistanis and powerful Iranian mullahs.”
You’ve never read the Qu’ran and the hadiths have you? Why do you think “wealthy Saudis and powerful Iranian mullahs” support it?
May 3, 2009 at 12:17 am
It’s funny how little green drama queen charles johnson calls people and political parties who are pro-Israel a bunch of neo-nazi’s. Last time i checked the real neo-nazi’s are still very much anti-israel and still nurture their Jew hatred. You could even see them marching alongside the muslims during the last anti-Israel protests.
It’s no wonder the religion of peace website voted Charles johnson as their dhimwit of the month
May 3, 2009 at 12:37 am
REPLY+ to instinct says. So just what constitutes a “real” Nazi? I mean a REAL Nazi? That’s the problem. You don’t know unless they annonce it? Are you that fucking stupid? Talk about thinking for oneself.
May 3, 2009 at 4:22 am
Wow, Republicans are getting so politically correct. I predict in about two years, you and Charles will be actively working against the white working-class of the world.
May 3, 2009 at 9:24 am
Trivkovic leader of the Bosnian Serbs during ethnic cleansing? Utter nonsense.
May 3, 2009 at 10:58 am
Hey john boy..how’s that arse kissing working for you. Getting under nancy’s skirts are you
May 3, 2009 at 11:36 am
The impression when watching Johnson’s latest contorsions is that he’s sincere but been caught in conflicting positions – however, when applying the “cui prodest” test of purity to his performance a simple truth emerges: scandal=hits.
He’s not even a contrarian, all what drives him is desire of more hits, and absurdities delivered with straight face apparently manage to work this way because irritate people who respond.
May 3, 2009 at 2:16 pm
Hi Realwest, Cato! Thanks for visiting.
From 2000 till 2008, the Left did have some critics of Lefty extremists, but most of those critics were in Britain. The Lefties at Harry’s Place, Norm Geras and other “drink soaked troskyite popinjays for war” were protesting Lefty extremism for years.
But they also support Obama. I think, in Leftist-moderate eyes, anyway, that he and the Democrats are not seen as extreme.
May 3, 2009 at 2:27 pm
You’ve never read the Qu’ran and the hadiths have you? Why do you think “wealthy Saudis and powerful Iranian mullahs” support it?
I’ve read enough about Saudi history to know that they do what they do because Wahhabi culture has always been based on genocide, intolerance and hate. In 1921, Winston Churchill said of the Sauds:
In the vast deserts of Arabia, which stretch eastward and north-eastward from the neighbourhood of Mecca to the Persian Gulf and to the boundaries of Mesopotamia, there dwell the people of Nejd, powerful nomadic tribes, at the head of whom the remarkable chief Bin Saud maintains himself. This Arab chief has long been in a state of warfare, raid, and reprisal with King Hussein and with his neighbours generally. A large number of Bin Saud’s followers belong to the Wahabi sect, a form of Mohammedanism which bears, roughly speaking, the same relation to orthodox Islam as the most militant form of Calvinism would have borne to Rome in the fiercest times of the religious wars. The Wahabis profess a life of exceeding austerity, and what they practise themselves they rigorously enforce on others. They hold it as an article of duty, as well as of faith, to kill all who do not share their opinions and to make slaves of their wives and children. Women have been put to death in Wahabi villages for simply appearing in the streets. It is a penal offence to wear a silk garment. Men have been killed for smoking a cigarette, and as for the crime of alcohol, the most energetic supporter of the temperance cause in this country falls far behind them. Austere, intolerant, well-armed, and bloodthirsty, in their own regions the Wahabis are a distinct factor which must be taken into account, and they have been, and still are, very dangerous to the holy cities of Mecca and Medina, and to the whole institution of the pilgrimage, in which our Indian fellow-subjects are so deeply concerned.
They haven’t changed. After 9/11, 95% of wealthy Saudis supported bin Laden’s goals. 55% of the suicide bombers in the Sunni ‘insurgency’ in Iraq were Saudis. They were sent to Iraq to wage war against America with the approval of King Abdullah.
Iranians call the extremist Mullahs and their followers “Wahhabis” or Arabs. The Islamist revolution in Iran is based on Wahhabi ‘ideals’. So are the deobandi Taliban.
Saudis and powerful mullahs support the Islamist paramilitary war against the west for the same reasons all genocidal demagogue wannabes wage wars of aggression – they want to dominate the world, kill everyone they hate and get themselves some Lebensraum.
May 3, 2009 at 4:18 pm
Republicans are getting so politically correct. I predict in about two years, you and Charles will be actively working against the white working-class of the world..
As I said in this post, I’m not a Republican. I just object to any political entity that sees ethnic cleansing and the deportation of non-criminals as a solution to political problems.
May 3, 2009 at 7:54 pm
This is a very interesting discussion, and one wich is long overdue in the islam-critical scene. Personaly, I come from the far left in Europe and have been an active anti-fascist all my life. Even though I disagree with LGF on almost every point, big kudos to him for going after the fascists in his own ranks. The folks who will criticise this stance will be twofold: Dumbasses who just hate muslims because thats the cool thing to do, and real educated fascists who seek to create a powerbase out of the first group.
A couple of important tricks in the ongoing struggle: Differentiate always between fascism (a general ideology) and nazism. Speak politely, avoid firing flames back. You will be flamed constantly, called jew-hater etc., see above. Dont let it bring you down. Keep on kicking. And there is a lot of left-wing resources out there commited to fighting fascism as well ;-)
May 3, 2009 at 8:24 pm
PS: Geller on her blog sites a long conversation with dane Lars Hedegaard. Hedegaard is one of the “acceptable” anti-jihadis in Denmark, but got marked in a speech he held at the opening of Århus against Mosques” where he spoke to an audience of 200 where at least 50 were or still are members of the nazi-hooligan group White Pride, several of them sentenced for violence and racism. Hedegaard after the meeting told reporters that he had talked to nearly everyone, and found “no right-wing extremists there, just concerned citizens”.
Further, in Denmark the SIAD-group wich seeks to represnt a pure anti-jihadism has had much in common with the nazi group Dansk Front and its various members, employing them as bodyguards. Just sayin…
May 4, 2009 at 9:06 am
Perhaps this is what could be expected.
Here we have a continent where they used to gas minorities. How smart is it to open the gates and let millions and millions of people enter?
I believe the multicultural society was supposed to be an anti-dote to Nazism. But I fear all it does is rehabilitate Hitler.
Here is the problem: Can you really blame Europeans for going to extreme meassures to save their societies? I mean, Hitler managed to stir fear against a tiny powerless and mostly invisible minority. Imagine how much fear and hatred a huge society as Islam could generate? Jews didn’t commit suicide attacks, still they were exterminated.
So how smart is it to force people to give up their identity and flood a country with strangers? What if the population does not wish to do accept them? What if somebody comes along and promises a radical solution in order to saveguard identity and culture?
If Europe continues to devolop towards Eurabia, I fear this will wake up a demon which has been asleep since 1945.
This is why at this stage I support Wilders. I would support anyone who puts the breaks on this, and I don’t care what their motives are. Whatever radicalism is contained within the anti-jihadist right-wing movement of Europe at this time, is nothing to what we may be witnessing in 20 years if this continues.
My biggest fear is that Europeans confronted with the loss of their identity will come to the conclusion that Hitler was right.
Already there is the widespread belief that Muslims and Jews constitute some kind of race. If you critisize Islam you are a racist. And a Jew is a Jew even if he is not religious. This means the seed of racism is wel ingrained in European culture.
May 7, 2009 at 4:13 pm
fnord – Further, in Denmark the SIAD-group wich seeks to represnt a pure anti-jihadism has had much in common with the nazi group Dansk Front and its various members, employing them as bodyguards.
Thanks for the helpful comments. Interesting info about Hedegaard…
May 7, 2009 at 4:19 pm
I believe the multicultural society was supposed to be an anti-dote to Nazism. But I fear all it does is rehabilitate Hitler.
Europe let the immigrants come to their country because they needed cheap labor. Europeans tried to pass laws to keep their “guest workers” from becoming full citizens. I’m not sure if they succeeded. But in any case, European citizenship is based on ethnic and cultural identity. No matter how long your family has been in a country like Germany, if you’re a Turk, a Somali or even if you’re an Italian, you can never really be “German”